Secondary thoughts on Slalom- Secondary Schools that is.

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John Gilmour
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Post by John Gilmour » Fri May 09, 2003 6:53 pm

I have a black thumb. All plants around me eventually perish. But things that have a tendancy to endure do so. I own a Turtle that I have had for 23 years. Things that grow slowly and steadily do well with me.

When I was in South Kent Boarding school as a freshman in 1977 kids lined up to get jackets "lettered" with their sports of choice. Some said. "South Kent Football" Some said "South Kent Lacrosse" South Kent Basket ball etc.

I chose to get a Jacket that said "South Kent Downhill Slalom". Kids would ask me if I meant "Skiing" and I said no....actually skateboarding. And to show the other kids I was serious about trying to make skateboarding a sport in our school I started a skateboard club with a friend- and even got an indoor area with ramps set up.

Then a kid named Jonathan Rhein decided to bomb the hill at the school with NO PADS- a hill that I used to luge. He wiped out cut his chin and scraped his back and knees and promptly got skateboarding banned from my school. My 27 inch fibreflex kicktail with powerflex 5's and Tracker midtracks collected dust as did my Hester and other decks.

But no one at any other schools started any other skateboard clubs- we had no one to compete with.

Here is a nutshell is the typical Gilmour plan.

Do slalom clinics with Connecticut boarding schools (those NYC CEO's kids have to go to school somewhere). Have the kids get introduced to racing and do a mock race or better still do two boarding schools in close proximity to each other in the same day. From 11am-2pm the kids practice and from 3pm-5pm the kids race another school nearby. They race as a real sport- in their schools respective Soccer uniforms. We get several of these Connecticut schools racing.

Cheap airfares are key. As are the parents nearly bottomless supply of frequent flyer miles.

The kids can afford the gear and the travel and become integrated in our racing circuit- at least regionally, quickly.

In Washington DC there are lot of other private secondary boarding schools. (Those Senators kids have to go to school somewhere). We do the same program down there.

In Miami and West Palm Beach there are a lot of Private schools. (Those SuperYacht owners kids have to go to school somwhere). We do the same program down there.

In order for a school to take slalom seriously there has to be a season that coincides with a semester. Typically Fall semester is from Sept- Nov.

In September (middle of the month) the Connecticut schools host a EAST COAST CUP Series #1 The DC schools and Florida schools attend- and they escape the heat and humidity.

In October (Third week of the month)the Washington DC schools host EAST COAST CUP Series #2 and Connecticut and Florida schoools attend- and they escape the heat and the cold.

In November before Thanksgiving the Florida schools Host EAST COAST CUP #3 Finale. Connecticut and DC schools escape the cold and rain.

Snow rarely hits Connecticut before December.

Also the ski teams of Connecticut schools could use this as pre season training.

Someone please add to this or correct me.


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: John Gilmour on 2003-05-09 13:08 ]</font>

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Post by Henry Julier » Fri May 09, 2003 9:04 pm

John-

A great plan so far, but with some difficulties.

I think assuming that a school would fly its kids (whether they pay for it or not) from Florida to Connecticut, or visa-versa, is an unsafe assumption. Kids at boarding school have commitments, but more importantly, homework. I hear people tell me all the time, "just wait untill college, you will be working all night, then you will appreciate naps, etc" Fact is, Prep school kids, especially at Deerfield, Andover, Exeter, Hotchkiss, you name it, get shiitloads of homework. Compare to Deerfield, college will be easy, which is the point I guess.

I think that we should try to grow slalom regionally in schools before trying to run inter-regional events (such as you suggest in your post Gilly)

I think that having the season in the fall is our best bet- less rain, less commitments (graduation, prom, parents weekend, etc all are scrunched in in May here)

John, you have a good contact here in the form of John Friends, who knows a lot of other people at other schools due to his years of coaching snowboarding at out neighbor school Eaglebrook.

The interest in slalom skateboarding is out there. I have seen it emerge first hand here at Deerfield. Holding these little clinics (especially at private boarding schools) will give us a bang for our buck I think.

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Post by John Gilmour » Sat Oct 11, 2003 2:47 am

I spoke with john Friends last night. Hopefully we will get to do Deerfield clinic soon.

Scheduled for October 19th (sorry Dave G. I'll be missing your race) is the Hotchkiss Clinic #2. Last time Ur13 and PSR and I did that Clinic and the kids were very stoked. Even the Dean of students Keith Moon- (no relation to THE WHO) skated- too bad my Dean wasn't as in touch with the students.

This time we will be bringing a timer and lots of decks and so forth. I'll ask Howard for cones so the kids can have something to practice with. The kids there are so smart that they can design their own timers.

I'll check back a few times witht eh school since it is near my folks.

A few other Boarding schools are thinking about the program. Gary Holl- can I bogart your syllabus? Saw it on Skateninja.com JK's site.

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Post by Terry Kirby » Sat Oct 11, 2003 2:55 am

What about the poor kids? We could go to Wilbur Cross High School in New Haven but I think the E 500 would get jacked. We can't make Slalom an Elitest sport like snowboard racing has become especially since slalom racing gear is so cheap. TK

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Hotchkiss rescheduled- Oct 19th cancelled move to Nov. 2.

Post by John Gilmour » Tue Oct 14, 2003 5:28 pm

Hotchkiss clinic rescheduled there is a rock climbing demo for the same day so we push to Nov. 2.
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Post by Rich Stephens » Tue Oct 14, 2003 10:08 pm

I applaud your efforts.

In a few years, fly those soft prep school kids out here so our west coast homeschooled kids can "take 'em to school" and finish their education, ha!

-Slim
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Post by Dan Mitchell » Wed Oct 15, 2003 2:21 am

If any of the DC guys would like to attend, I think that day is open for me. I can drive (from York) or share expenses.
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Post by John Gilmour » Wed Oct 15, 2003 3:08 am

Yo Rich- look at the slalom video in the thread...Where are my cones?

He's a 9th grader.
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Post by Rich Stephens » Wed Oct 15, 2003 3:13 am

I checked it out earlier. Very cool. I'm just joking with you John. It's great you are getting some kids into it. There's kind of a gap right now between the 8-10 year olds and the 30s and 40s crew. It would be interesting to see what kids that are at their late teen early 20s physical peak can do.
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Post by Jani Soderhall » Wed Oct 15, 2003 11:24 am

Rich Stephens wrote:There's kind of a gap right now between the 8-10 year olds and the 30s and 40s crew. It would be interesting to see what kids that are at their late teen early 20s physical peak can do.
Rich,

One good thing about the European slalom scene right now is that it's basically built only by those in their early to mid 20's. The older guys are in clear minority. That's very promising.

Thought you'd all like to know.

/Jani

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Teacher, I criddled my homework.

Post by John Gilmour » Wed Oct 15, 2003 12:49 pm

That will be the day- when I let a 20 year old kid beat me ;) I'll need advanced arthritus first. I've got arthritus...but it ain't advanced enough yet.

Rich, would you like to try and do the same thing with Prep schools in CA? I can assure you it is some of the most fun you will ever have skating.

I want to get a slalomcircuit going with the NorthEast, Midatlantic , and Florida going at it. Adding CA would allow us to have a National youth Championship.

I'm not talking about EVERY school. Just get 2 or 3 from each area. Hopefully that would grow to 5 or more schools in each area...plenty for a circuit.
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Post by John Gilmour » Wed Oct 15, 2003 2:16 pm

John-

A great plan so far, but with some difficulties.

I think assuming that a school would fly its kids (whether they pay for it or not) from Florida to Connecticut, or visa-versa, is an unsafe assumption.

I think that Parents could ante up transferable frequent flyer miles. We are not talking about a team of 20 kids going off to slalom- just about 3-7 students per school. I also think schools might combine the kids or a parent would chapparone. Of course they could also drive. Only the end of the season race in Florida would require driving for the East or Mid Atlantic states.

Kids at boarding school have commitments, but more importantly, homework. I hear people tell me all the time, "just wait untill college, you will be working all night, then you will appreciate naps, etc" Fact is, Prep school kids, especially at Deerfield, Andover, Exeter, Hotchkiss, you name it, get shiitloads of homework. Compare to Deerfield, college will be easy, which is the point I guess.

believe me- you have tons of free time in college (except at CM) compared to boarding school- where every free minute is scheduled to keep kids out of trouble and accountable, also some of the less competitive schools might have more available free time (though often it is less- to occupy the troublemakers) I'm sure you've gone to an athletic event where you come home later -eat on the road, - miss the sit down formal dinner and go directly to study in the dorms....my point being, time can be made available if the administration endorses the sport.


I think that we should try to grow slalom regionally in schools before trying to run inter-regional events (such as you suggest in your post Gilly)

Yes we should grow it regionally, but I do think we could assign regions to people and then sew the ones that flourish together. Otherwise older regions would have a discouraging lead over the newer ones. Close racing is the most exciting and encourages the most practice and skills building. Travel will always be part of slalom.

I think that having the season in the fall is our best bet- less rain, less commitments (graduation, prom, parents weekend, etc all are scrunched in in May here)

I also went to boarding school(s) the workload in the spring was harder and the terms did feel very compressed vs the fall semester.. So I agree that the fall semester is the best candidate. It seems like you don't even have time to breathe in the spring with applications, independent study projects, few holidays, parental visits, prom, senior pranks, sneaking off campus to the girlfriends house, signing out to bogus camping trips with girls (forgot about that one didn't you), socials with girls schools, etc..


John, you have a good contact here in the form of John Friends, who knows a lot of other people at other schools due to his years of coaching snowboarding at out neighbor school Eaglebrook.

The interest in slalom skateboarding is out there. I have seen it emerge first hand here at Deerfield. Holding these little clinics (especially at private boarding schools) will give us a bang for our buck I think.

I also think that we don't need special competitions for these kids. We just integrate the kids into a kids league at existing competitions at first. For instance....This coming up Fayettesville Bridge day race would be a really cool field trip for kids who could also see Base Jumping, Bungee Jumping, and fireworks as well as learn to race in front of thousands of screaming spectators.

(luckily they wouldn't see the rally the next week- Halloween comes early for West Virginia)

Of course I would hope that the kids would organize their own interscholastic competitions themselves as they have done for other intramural events like Ultimate Frisbee. This can give the kids leadership and planning skills that are valuable in later life. They could go to one of our contests and then attempt to throw their own and learn from their mistakes.

My hopes is that creative kids with a little time on their hands will actually help us develop solutions to our current racing quandries.
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Re: Teacher, I criddled my homework.

Post by Rich Stephens » Wed Oct 15, 2003 8:47 pm

John Gilmour wrote: Rich, would you like to try and do the same thing with Prep schools in CA? I can assure you it is some of the most fun you will ever have skating.

I want to get a slalomcircuit going with the NorthEast, Midatlantic , and Florida going at it. Adding CA would allow us to have a National youth Championship.
I live in a fairly isolated area at the moment, I'm just getting into slalom so wouldn't be a good coach, and I'm not quite sure I see the point in developing slalom racers as some sort of sideline activity separate from the core of the surf/skate lifestyle.

I mean, I wish you well in the sense that you saw something you'd like to see and have gone out and put your own time and effort behind it, but it's just a totally different world from the one I live in. I'd rather see my kid grow up to be a member of Black Leather Racing than a member of congress, ha!

-slim
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You must have straight f's to slalom and be core.

Post by John Gilmour » Tue Oct 21, 2003 7:29 am

I see a lot of backlash against the Prep School kids and by more than one person- and this reply isn't directed to Rich Stephens.

First off...they are just Kids..minors- and we shouldn't hold the possibility that they might have a stable financial background against them (fact is that 75% of the kids get financial aid- prep schools aren't just for rich spoiled kids anymore).

Again- I am positive about my assumptions that the Prep schools will give us the most participation for our efforts. I look to them as being the "Seed crystal" for a youth slalom league.

Lets say that each area only has a few kids slaloming. I can think of 3 kids in Connecticut, about 5 in Massachusetts, a couple in California and Mississippi. Not a whole lot of kids.

In fact it is hard to get even 10 kids in the same sex category to compete. How competitive is that? IF we had say 10 kids who were able to fly around to races- it would be much more encouraging for other kids to race.

On ncdsa I see people upset about non core skaters getting into slalom.

Well that is just plain narrow minded- anyone who wants to give it a shot and has the guts to do it should. Should someone who wants to be a skater have to buy the clothes, live the lifestyle, learn to railslide first, then only after being a "core skater" learn to slalom?

I've noticed Aaron Morris (14) slaloming since the third Gathering in MD. He is getting really good. But you know...he has to skate with Adults...which is fine until all the Adults say "let's go celebrate with a beer"- and Aaron is left out in the cold.

I was at the WV race this past weekend and Aaron was the ONLY kid there.
I noticed. I'm sure he was aware of it. Would Aaron enjoy having 10 kids fly in from up and down the Eastern Seaboard to race with him? You bet.

In California there are now almost always enough kids for a kids division... but that is California, and in most other places in the World...that ain't the case.

I want to see kids like Aaron having more fun. AND I want to see them racing competitively in their own division with a group of racers close to each other in age and skill level- not just a bunch of blowout dual races, which IMHO look silly for both participants (I'd almost rather see it done as single track if blowout duals are likely). At teh moment I only see kids participating in slalom races and traveling to slalom races IF THEIR PARENTS RACE ALSO.

For Aaron to be able to go to a place Like WV and reasonably expect other kids to be there there has to be either a bunch of kids racing in WV (I'd didn't see any local kids with slalom decks) or a bunch of kids who can travel. The 14-18 year age bracket in Prep schools fits this.

But there still are bunch of people opposed to the prep school idea. Maybe its some sort of strange inferiority complex (ie. they are richer and smarter than I am...will they make me feel stupid?).

Should Lauren and Dylan Gordon not be able to slalom because they live in a larger house than Josh Byrd?

Well its a big world out there and there ARE people out there who are richer and or smarter- no big deal. As a teenager I went to a 3rd tier Prep school (lived in Manhattan in a modest 2bdrm apartment with a beautiful view of an airshaft and brick wall) and I did meet kids from other schools that were smarter and richer than I was...and you know... I FELT it more than a Public school kid because you could compare your prep school S.S.A.T. scores directly - and I could compare their school's amazing new facilities to my schools smaller out of date trashed facilities, and if you went to the houses..it was ridiculous. The top tier kids would get perfect SSAT scores and some of them lived on Park avenue in multi -million dollar homes. But you learn to accept people for who they are and not what they own or where they went to High school- whether richer or poorer. Not accepting them makes you the loser/bigot- not them.

Teaching Inner city kids to slalom will work if we can get the kids low cost or free gear, and provide free transportation and lodging to races. I don't have a budget for this.

My hopes are that at a later date we would involve the Prep school kids to form an Outreach group like they have done in other sports such as skiing - and take Inner city kids along with them to competitions as they do in skiing and help donate used gear to inner city kids as well. But in order for that to happen we need to get the prep schools going first........or find someone willing to donate a large sum of cash to inner city programs.


OR make slalom an accepted competitive sport (not just an intramural sport) at a school...something I'd like to applaud John Kim for attempting. I've only seen it done at one school...in a small town in Switzerland.
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Post by Rich Stephens » Tue Oct 21, 2003 4:50 pm

John, that was a very good post with so much good stuff. But this part I have to comment on:
"But there still are bunch of people opposed to the prep school idea. Maybe its some sort of strange inferiority complex (ie. they are richer and smarter than I am...will they make me feel stupid?)."
It's that attitude that many of us find disgusting. It's very pervasive amongst the "rich" and "successful". They think that if they are viewed with suspicion by others, these others must be jealous or have an inferiority complex.

In reality, there are just as many smart people who have chosen to live outside the rat race that is prep school and corporate American than in it. We just have different values. And it is this clash of values that is responsible for our negative view of prep-schools and the families that attend them.

(Here's a simple example. When I resent someone driving around in an expensive Lincoln SUV, it's not because they can afford it and I probably couldn't right now that bothers me: it's the simple fact that they are selfish enough to drive such a vehicle, using tons of gas, creating a danger to others on the road, etc. If that's "smart", I want nothing to do with it and would prefer my kids not hang around people who can't see how that choice is so seriously flawed).

-Rich

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Post by John Gilmour » Tue Oct 21, 2003 5:48 pm

Rich Stephens wrote:John, that was a very good post with so much good stuff. But this part I have to comment on:
"But there still are bunch of people opposed to the prep school idea. Maybe its some sort of strange inferiority complex (ie. they are richer and smarter than I am...will they make me feel stupid?)."
It's that attitude that many of us find disgusting. It's very pervasive amongst the "rich" and "successful". They think that if they are viewed with suspicion by others, these others must be jealous or have an inferiority complex.


In reality, there are just as many smart people who have chosen to live outside the rat race that is prep school and corporate American than in it. We just have different values. And it is this clash of values that is responsible for our negative view of prep-schools and the families that attend them.

(Here's a simple example. When I resent someone driving around in an expensive Lincoln SUV, it's not because they can afford it and I probably couldn't right now that bothers me: it's the simple fact that they are selfish enough to drive such a vehicle, using tons of gas, creating a danger to others on the road, etc. If that's "smart", I want nothing to do with it and would prefer my kids not hang around people who can't see how that choice is so seriously flawed).

-Rich
I'm not so sure that there is such a divide in America between the rich and the poor- I feel the media portrays it that way.

I think that within our group of skaters there exist different values and I think that is one of the things that makes the slalom scene so interesting.

Frankly the car size I drive now is influenced by the amount of SUV's on the road.If there were about 1/20th of the SUV's on the road I would have bought a used Austin Healy and fixed it up- I can't...no one in a large SUV would see it, so I'll never get to own a small classic convertible. I test drove an Excursion and nearly swept a station wagon off the road that hid in the blind spot.


A few years ago I was considering leasing a Ford Excursion for our snowboard company, I thought we had a genuine need for such a car with a demo fleet of 30 boards, display racks, sound system, tuning tables, need to drive in bad weather almost all the time etc. Instead I just stuffed all of that in a 15 year old Audi 5000s wagon with a roof box.

The point? Obviously I would prefer and America without SUV's and more 4wd wagons. I have to drive a midsized sedan as a result and my car gets about 15-22 mpg. So in a sense I have to pay nearly double for gas because the SUV's dictate to me the minimum size car I feel safe in if someone were to collide with me. I don't want to contribute to the problem. In a mid size sedan I'm not likely to cause fatalities to an occupants in a Mini Cooper and due to my cars build solid quality I might survive an accident with an SUV.

BUT- I would certainly still skate with a kid from a prep school or inner city as much as I will continue to hang out with my SUV driving friends. I certainly wouldn't expect you not to hang out with someone for the values a person has with the type of car they drive- would that make you just as "particular" as the Prep school crowd? If it at all helps- you see many many more 4wd subaru/volvo/audi/saturn/toyota/vw wagons at prep schools than Cadillac Escalades (if you are wondering...where are the American cars... few make an America wagon). If it helps- I've never seen an Escalade or Lincoln SUV at a prep school yet. Personally if I ever had kids that went to prep school- I'd drive them up in a compact car so I wouldn't have to pack/carry so much uneeded crap.

Rich Please don't give up on the idea of starting a clinic at a local school- and it doesn't have to be a prep school- and if the kid happens to drive an SUV, it might be a car handed down to him from a family member, don't hold it against him. Also you might be pleasantly surprised by the values of the kids at these schools- I certainly was.
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Post by Anthony Smallwood » Wed Oct 22, 2003 4:48 am

Just for the record, my thoughts on introducing slalom to under-privileged kids really has nothing to do with growing the sport. It's more about providing a vehicle for positive social interaction and competition to a segment of the population in dire need.
We just had a brazen, mid-afternoon shootout between two El Salvadorian gangs, 10 blocks from the White House. 1 dead, several wounded, including a Metro bus driver. Everyone is freaked over the brazen attitudes of the gangs, but if you've ever read "Salvador" by Joan Didion, you'd probably say "you ain't seen nothin' yet"!
Could they be "saved by slalom"?
I have known kids on the borderline. One positive opportunity and they want more. The cycles are vicious, but they can be broken.
So I'm probably looking for something a little bit different than the rest of you, though I believe everyone's efforts are pure.
Believe me, a trip to Gaithersburg for the Gathering would be less than 20 miles away for these kids though it might as well be California.
And no John, I sure the hell don't have anything against preppies or the monied class. To me, nothing beats going to a White House party and a sketchy back alley, all in the same night. I love my rich and powerful friends though I must say, the street folk are a lot more interesting.

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Post by Leonardo Ojeda » Wed Oct 22, 2003 7:13 am

Anthony Smallwood wrote: So I'm probably looking for something a little bit different than the rest of you, though I believe everyone's efforts are pure.
Believe me, a trip to Gaithersburg for the Gathering would be less than 20 miles away for these kids though it might as well be California.
Hey anthony, i know what u are talking about, i remember when we were in the metro the face of the kid looking at my slalom board, and your longboard, u can see that its something that attracts thier attention in a sec. i always say that this sport its "cleaner" than ollie skaters, cause most of them have that "me against the world" attitude not so popular amongst parents.
i know that u will be supported by a company soon, u are creating your own path to travel into, i hope that a lot of persons join you in your journey.


take care dude

Leo
"I`ll see you at the end of the hill"

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Secondary Schools as source for new slalom racers

Post by Pat Chewning » Wed May 12, 2004 9:19 pm

Last year about this time I contacted the local high-school ski race coaches to try to drum up some interest in slalom skateboarding. I had no success. (I was a former ast coach of the ski team for a local school.)

This year, I was contacted by one of the racers who, along with 4 of his friends, has formed a longboarding club at the school. They have been trying some slalom on their own. They are doing longboard slalom at about 8' to 10' spacing.

I've invited them to join us for practice sessions, and they were very interested in the Cascade Slalom Association race schedule.

So it looks like we have about 5 new racers with ski racing background.

That's progress.

-- Pat

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Show them

Post by John Gilmour » Thu May 13, 2004 5:22 pm

Maybe the answer is a video...

If we shot a small 5 minute DVD showing the similarities to snowboard and ski racing.......

1. clip with Glenn and Ben Chapman (both snowboard and skateboard racers) talking about how it has helped them
2. Clip with good parallel technique for the skiers
3. Talk about the racing similarities in bracketing and how this experience is helpful for strategy
4. Show the low cost aspect.


................and distributed this to a person like John Friends- who meets with ALL of the ski coaches at the big snowboard meets


We might have them wanting to contact us...instead of the other way around.


AS it is now- Most of the video we need has already been shot. We could take and excerpt from Freewwheeling with BP, Shots of the Chapmans racing- shots of Brewington in Paris (so they can relate the World Cup concept) and FCR series.

What's left? About 2 minutes of interviews.
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Hotchkiss September 11th

Post by John Gilmour » Wed Aug 31, 2005 6:38 pm

Hotchkiss is a go again this year for September 11th.

As always the call goes out for help.

Helmets, loaner gear, timing system..

anyone want to help?

I also met with the head of athletics at Salisbury so we are on our way to getting a little league going.

email me johngilmour@rocketmail.com if you can help on that date.
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Post by John Gilmour » Wed Aug 31, 2005 8:42 pm

Stepanek and Iacovelli are on deck for September 11 2005 at Hotchkiss...anyone got Brammers contact info?

Fatboy can provide some extra boards..any extra slalom decks would be helpful as well as safety gear.

Lastly- I someone with an AOL account that I can send a file to with video and photos from the last Hotchkiss event- then that person has to send it to tway so he can edit a video out of it (About 60 seconds.)

Or if anyone is up for it...that's great...I need to get this done right away though.
I'll be online as

slalomslalom

on aol
JG
Last edited by John Gilmour on Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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john gilmour

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Post by John Gilmour » Wed Aug 31, 2005 9:03 pm

anyone out there?

slalomslalom on AIM looking for a buddy 10:4
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

Shane Anderson
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Prep Schools

Post by Shane Anderson » Tue Sep 06, 2005 7:22 pm

Hi John...

Interesting... in 1977 I was at Canterbury in New Milford. I went on to graduate from Williston Northampton Academy. This was between the years 1975 and 1978...

I played Football, was a swimmer, and played Lacrosse. I wonder if you and I ever "met." My best friend growing up was a fellow called Peter Arnold. He went to South Kent. Good football player, and was on Crew at S. Kent. Perhaps you knew him. He'd have been a "Townie."

Your story about getting skateboarding banned is interesting. I used to ride a road near Canterbury called Resavoir Road. I used to bomb it top to bottom (after a bunch of practice runs .. starting lower and moving higher). One day about '76 I took a couple of upper classmen up to to "the Res." I bombed the hill. Showing off... yes... but I had done it before and knew what I was doing. Had my Excalibur trucks tighter than hell among other things, and knew what to expect.

Needless to say these guys were not to be outdone by a sophomore. They both started out at the same time. One of them bailed in short order. The other one continued, caught the high speed "wobbs" about two thirds of the way down and ended up doing a Superman all laid out onto the asphalt. We rushed him to the ER to pick the road out of his rash. The next day I got a serious shake down by what amounted to a specially convened Screw Crew. They did not ban skateboards on campus, but they almost did.

Anyway, I think what you are doing is very worthwhile. I wish you lots of luck with this.

Shane Anderson
Williston Northampton Academy
Class of '78

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Post by John Gilmour » Thu Sep 08, 2005 1:38 pm

Hi Shane,

I was at South Kent School in South Kent Connecticut in fall 77- spring 78 and then went to Rio de Janeiro's Escola Americana in Brazil for a little over a year before returning to the States and finishing up at The Gunery School from Fall of 1979 to Spring 1981.

Killer skating in Brazil huge free public skateparks in 1978 skating with Eric Wilner (he had a half pipe in his back yard down the street from me) and crew from Spectro Skates.... like what Oregon has now.

Anyhow- of course I returned to find vert was dead on the East coast and turned to slalom, rejecting street because at the time it seemed so incredibly lame (curbgrinds???- WHAT was that?) compared to 15 foot vert walls and motorcycle tow-ins at these "anything goes" skateparks in Brazil. Liability in Brazil????It's like...do they even have Lawyers there?...let alone law- barely. And of course skating flourished there as a result of their endless summer like southern California.

Street in 1978 was nothing like it is today. So downhill and slalom were the only things available- finding a good patch of smooth pavement for freestyle (save for tennis courts) was also out of the question with the narrow paths in boarding school.

The Gunnery had no vert terrain but huge hills. I would luge route 47 from Washington Depot (50+) towards lake Waramug everyday for crew practice- luckily no faculty ever caught me.

BTW the Gunnery IS NEWLY PAVED AS OF 'da farm 5.0 . I suggest that is our next place for a demo and we can really put ona great Demo because the entire school is hilly. I think it might be the next slalom powerhouse.

I did know Peter Arnold- yes I remember he was a real townie (Dayhop?) and a cool townie, but I don't recall him skating-maybe he did. We started an indoor skate club in the basement of the SKS school house skating on old ping pong tables and what ever we could find. we got bored with it....but the funny thing is.....it would have looked a lot like a modern day street course at a local skatepark. but riding a 4 inch wide 27" fiberflex with powerflex 5's and midtracks- it just wasn't much fun. If we had the same place now with modern decks- I'm sure it would have gotten a lot of use. The skaters there??? There were about 4 kids who knew how to skateboard at SKS when I got there- Jon W., Peter Fisler, Hogi Hyun and myself.

In contrast to today where so many kids know how to skateboard- being that skateboarding IS the largest participant sport for youth in America today.

Of course today kids could learn a lot about construction techniques>> building their own ramps (home depot is affordable)- >>>mechanics from racing,.......... and that perseverance pays off -as dedication and practice always pays dividends. etc. etc.. etc.. Skateboarding NOW is far far far more positive than negative...

Certainly the top vert skaters of today are positive role models- and in some cases...very good businessmen as well.

So Shane....why not come out to Hotchkiss this weekend and help make skating in Boarding schools a reality. No such thing as too much help.

You'll be able to see our demo from the main gates of Hotchkiss.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Shane Anderson » Fri Sep 09, 2005 2:35 pm

>> So Shane....why not come out to Hotchkiss this weekend and help make skating in
>> Boarding schools a reality. No such thing as too much help.

I have a prior engagement. I would very much like to follow up with any further efforts in this regard however. I'll send a PM.

Best,

Shane

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Hotchkiss September 11th 2005 highschool slalom

Post by John Gilmour » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:29 pm

All helpers....

We will meet at 12:00 in front of the main building just past the Giant Bull statues in the main circle.

We will survey- get lunch- and then set up.

Set up will be in the same place as last year---but this year we may try a "B" site with a steeper grade and faster more tech course....just really more for demo...hopefully near to the carnival.

Hotchkiss Carnival is from 12-4pm the same day so wives and kids will have plenty to do...not just cone marshalling or running a timing table....lol.... should be a perfect day for everyone. Lots of REAL CARNIVAL RIDES- very cool. free.

With a carnival there is sure to be outside food as well.

Those who don't come....well you are going to miss out...hope to see you at the next location.

PSR as the USA's top Private Juniors coach....we'll miss you. hope to see you at the next one.

cook out or dinner at my place afterwards-less than 2 miles from the school.

JG
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Glenn Chapman » Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:34 pm

John, I could possibly make it down. Give me a call if you need help.
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Regards,
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directions

Post by John Gilmour » Sun Sep 11, 2005 6:27 am

From Boston takeI- 90 west to I-84 towards Hartford You'll pass through hartford. 1.5 hours

In Connecticut Take I-84 to exit 39 the farmington route 4 exit.

Off exit ramp go straight onto Rt. 4 west.
Stay on Rt. 4 west for about 10 minutes, you will pass under an overpass with a sign that says 2005 league champions it is the only overpass. Appoximately 2 miles past that will be Rt. 177 North

You'll see Rt. 177N off to your right at a traffic light.

take rt. 177 North (you will go right by Elisa Cambell's old house)

follow 177 until you hit a large 4 lane intersection , that is rt. 44. Takes about 10 minutes

You'll see an Ethan Allen furniture store at that intersection.

Go left onto Rt. 44 west.

Stay on rt. 44 going towards Winstead- you'll pass a lot of stuff. You'll be on it for a while.

After about 30-40 minutes you'll see signs for Salisbury. continue onwards.

You'll cross over Rt. 7 continue on 44 west. about .5 miles after you cross route 7 - route 44 west will take a 90 degree right turn - be careful or you could miss the sign....some people bent it. wicked bad.

Continue on 44 west. you'll see signs for Lakeville and later for Sharon.

You'll pass the White Hart restaurant and inn on your right ...continue on 44 west. You'll pass Salisbury school on your left....stay on rt. 44 west.

Then you'll come into the town of lakeville. You'll see a Mobil station by rt. 41 take that left.

Stay on 41. ina few minutes you'll start going up a big hill- 1/2 way up you'll see Hotchkiss schools tennis courts. At the top of the hill is a 4 way stop.

Go right at the 4 way stop and take first right into hotchkiss school.

We will meet in the parking circle by the main building at noon- survey, have lunch then set up.. and at 2:30 the instructional slalom area will be just to the right of that circle.


It looks longer on a map than taking I-90 to Lee...But I assure you it is much quicker. Using the mapquest I90 to Lee then Rt 7 took me almost 3 hours floored in my E500 and 4:15 with mild speeding.

This route.. took me about 2:40 minutes tonight- but I had all flashing lights through towns. Fastest time for this route 2:10 minutes. Slowest time 3:10. Depends on your driving. It is a really nice drive though- btw if you have a sports car- once you cross rt. 7.....44west is a twister- don't criddle.

Try to get a early start so you don't hit lunch time traffic.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Awesome

Post by Henry Julier » Tue Sep 13, 2005 12:46 am

John, good luck with your event at Hotchkiss! It's great to see slalom alive at boarding schools still. We have a great group of longboarders here at Carnegie Mellon and I'm amassing a good list of hills that I can bomb when I have the time. Hope we can meet up in the future soon... and I'll buy you a drink, my 21st birthday is tomorrow.

Henry J

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hotchkiss spring 04 video

Post by John Gilmour » Thu Sep 15, 2005 6:41 pm

hotchkiss video

http://www.slalomspot.com/gilmour

click on hotchkiss.mov
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Noah Heinle » Thu Sep 15, 2005 10:37 pm

Very nice.

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Post by Troy Smart » Fri Sep 16, 2005 2:22 am

Get on a plane. Dork.

You're missing the WORLDS.

You too, Gilmour.

And, yea, that was nice John. Wish I could have been there.

I also wish I could be at the Worlds.

And, I wish I had a million bucks. And I wish I had a completely rebuilt '77 Bronco. And I wish Bush was'nt such a wanker, and I wish that I just did'nt get a $100 dollar "excessive fuel cost" surcharge on my electric bill, and I wish my neighbors would turn off there million candelpower floodlight for just one freakin night, and I wish I had a BB gun and, I wish that blah, blah.

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Video

Post by John Gilmour » Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:04 pm

Hey Fluitt- hope you don't mind that I pirated your footage! Your commentary is killer.

I supplied the 2003 stills....

BTW the video short of the guy in the Red Sox Shirt ("He's angulating, He's Angulating") is Keith Moon, Hotchkiss Dean of Students for class of 2006....why wasn't my Dean that cool?

It's all in the name I suppose.

Karl did all the video editing- I picked the song, Peter Gabriel's Salibury Hill, which I hope will encourage Salisbury to compete. Why Salisbury? Because they seem to be Everyone's athletic rival. Many schools LOSE in EVERY SINGLE SPORT to Salisbury. So perhaps the other schools might look at slalom as a way to get a Victory over Salisbury.

Yes Salibury has an amazing hill for practice- Salibury hill will be one of the great racing venues in Connecticut- and Best of all.....it is right in Rt. 41 so lots of cars will pass by and see.

Now onto the good stuff. All those that helped get a check for skateboarding- if you never got a check for skateboarding before....we'll I suppose you are a pro now.

So please email me your contact + address info so I can send off a check to you. send to johngilmour@rocketmail.com

Other things to note. Fatboy had a very unsual cutaway wooden deck.....that tracked unbelieveably well...and as Joe I had it set up might be one of the best performing TS slalom decks for under $150- I felt very confident on it- even when compared to my Roe Bottle Rocket.

I asked about 40 kids if any had skatebaorded less than 6 months- while the kids were gathering to start.. only 2 raised their hands.

Confirming that Skateboarding is CLEARLY - BY FAR, the number one particpant sport for America's youth.

In stark contrast to the 1970's when out of 150 kids at my boarding school only about 8 had ever skated before and most were not very good.



Some interesting notes.

The very best girl slalomer, a "never ever skateboarder", - just started skating that morning. In less than 2 hours she was running the most advanced B course and almost made it... the B course was as hard a TS course than has ever been set in competition. She made all but the last 4 cones, riding a fat boy board with tracker rts rtx and avalons. She apparently is an excellent dancer and has such smart body control that she picked it up instantly.

She was very enthusiastic and wants to start a slalom + longboard club. AND-----....get this... her name is Hester. Why weren't any of the girls at my boarding school that cool?

It's all in the name I suppose.


So we ran a simple duals course, very easy, and then graduated people to the back hill- which has perfect fresh tar and a good grade with decent run out uphill.
----
Lots of girls trying everything. Most started on longboards and rode those around the circle..tons of smiling faces...all want us to come back in the spring or sooner.

We started skating at 2:30pm During the school carnival which of course made the kids amped up because they had a opening weekend carnival with rides, Pumped up air jumping house, jello wrestling which seemed to stain the girls legs and bikins red- making them look like ompa loompas when learning to skate. I do remember telling one small jello stained bikini clad girl who was wearing a helmet and not much else that she should wear knee pads and wrist guards because the only thing she had to fall on was SKIN- and without any resistance she suited right up.

Getting the kids enmasse to listen to the intro after the carnival was a challenge as compared to the last time we were there...so much sugar and activity- but they did well with only 1-3 skinned knees and lessons learned to wear saftey gear. As is usual with skateboarders...trying to organize them when they are excited is like herding cats.

Lots of cooperative learning within the kids...very nice. I would tell one kid something and they immediately passed the info along to their friends making them as a whole ... remarkably easy to teach.

Now I have to call The Gunnery and get another clinic going...they have the perfect campus for this as well. Perhaps we could do one on Saturday at the Gunnery and another one on Sunday at Salisbury.

Lastly- the kids need some sort of gear package that we can sell or perferably rent to a school. it should have a trunk with a timing system, software, cones , a signout sheet for equipment, rules , videos, and a few boards. Would someone be willing to volunteer to take on the task of figuring out what should go in there?

I wouldn't doubt that after about 5 times of signing out a board or finding that a board is ALREADY signed out...that kids would want their own. Manufacturers could sell the demos for 15% off of retail to keep the rental stock new.


Many thanks to Fatboy, Joe Iacovelli, Chris Stepanek, Scooter, Molly, Marshall, the West Hartford skaters, and others that helped.....don't forget to email me your contact info.

As for the Worlds, I would have gone if it was a weekend thing like in previous years and maybe have competed, but I couldn't take the two travel days + the week off- I wish I was there to see it. If I had to rent a hotel room for that length of time...I couldn't swing it. Sad to miss MB on year 5.

I'll make it to the next World's- where ever it is. It looks like Paris was a popular destination for competeing this year with aa very diverse field... I still think the East Coast would make a nice World's venue with flights equidistant for nearly everyone )CA, CO, TX, FL, MI, GA, NC,---- FR, Germany, Russia, CH, GB, ).....but where to hold it?
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Karl Floitgraf » Wed Mar 15, 2006 2:31 pm

So John what ever happened to Hotchkiss? Not afraid of a couple public school punks with no coach are they?
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Is that a challenge?

Post by John Gilmour » Thu Mar 16, 2006 5:18 am

Perhaps it is a time for the public schools to issue a challenge to the private schools.

What shall ye wager?

A trip to a famous skatepark? A pre paid slide clinic with slidemaster Cliff Coleman?

/////let's get some ideas going...at the end of every journey there should be a prize.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Karl Floitgraf » Thu Mar 16, 2006 3:59 pm

Uh yeah, half my guys don't even own their own boards and I'm supposed to put up for stuff like that?

Let me see what sort of sponsors we get for the race and then I think I have a good idea for a challenge.

Prize TBA: Fastest Youth Rookie, the person at the race up to 18 years old who has not competed in a major or prime race (da farm series does not count) who puts the fastest time down with cones.

I challenge anyone to beat Kam or Jake and possibly several others.
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Sceondary Schools

Post by Paul Pellerin » Fri Mar 17, 2006 1:43 am

Hey Karl,

Go for it!!! You have to step-up. PRP Racing has you covered. Let me know what you need or if I can help out.

Paul

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Pay....like you kids have money???

Post by John Gilmour » Thu Mar 23, 2006 4:37 am

In so far as the Slide clinic, well that was something that I thought s skater might donate. I could donate a day of coaching to the top school for instance, and I could ask Cliff if he would want to add a bunch of kids to an existing slide clinic for instance.

----

BUT- you guys have to have something at stake.

I do think though that you guys should put something on the line. So the team that loses has to give up something to the winning team. The decision to race for gear could be made by vote at each race. So you don't have to always race for something- but if hte teams look closely paired...it's likely to happen- and exciting.

In crew...we used to race for shirts.

Maybe you guys should race for wheels.

Winners gets the wheels off the other kids boards??? (Wheels then go into a bin to be traded for decks and trucks to put together new set ups for newbies)

Perhaps shirts is a better thing. (I just heard PRP breathe a sigh of relief)

Why don't you guys think of what you should win...only a few things should be off limits...Boards, trucks and cones.

IMHO Team shirts could be cool if you race well and collect a bunch. Wheels- well at leaast you know there is something to collect on.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Slalom wilde life.

Post by John Gilmour » Thu Mar 23, 2006 3:05 pm

Well, Karl, I suppose I could have coached you- and you guys would have blindly done what I said, and you would probably be faster skaters today without glaring issues of bad form , wrong set ups, poor race strategy, reading courses poorly, misjudging your competitors, skating over your head, selecting too fast a wheel, selecting too short a wheelbase, picking wheels without enough roll, or ones that deform too much, not switching wheels as the road temperatures change, forgetting to pace yourselves, ..........should I go on??? etc. etc. etc.

But, you wouldn't have learned anything for yourselves.

You also would have been so much faster than the other kids that you all would have kicked their asses so badly - much worse than you guys did in the early days,,,,,that the kids would have never gotten into it in the first place. They would have shown up for 1-3 practices and then bagged it- thinking that they would never be fast enough to win.

How do I know that?

I lived it.

When I first started slaloming....I wasn't that much faster than the other kids. I was definitely faster- but not unbeatable (Even though I never let myself get beaten lol..) at least it seemed like someone could possibly go faster than me from the speeds of the kids trying to beat me were within .....say 15% of my speed.



So lots of kids got into it. I had a whole slalom crew. Sure I was the Rabbit, I've always been the Rabbit (The Playboy logo has deeper meaning)- also I was born in the year of the Rabbit. And as the Rabbit it gave the others something that seemed within reach, but frustratingly always was out of reach. (Just like a really well designed video game).

Kids had to buy their own gear (And it was way harder to find even back then in the late 1970's and early 1980's) But they got it somehow- even without the internet. They went to endless flea markets-what a time waster. I started the Slalom courses in Central Park in 1975- and the Tavern on the Green course about a year later. At first it was all skateboarders (about 20 to 40 regulars!)- and later Inliners and later a few skateboarders. Not much of a course- high foot traffic (people always walking across the course)- no view, no reliable timing, all guys, just a bunch of cones on painted dots- and a dual course.



So I started a slalom scene in Boston in 1989. I wanted it to be much better. I had gear available for people to buy, a perfect newly paved hill for beginners with easy courses that changed to keep it fresh, posted rules and photographs, athletic girls skating in Bikinis along the river, a timing system set up intermittently, free loaner decks for beginners, newspaper + television recognition, a high foot traffic area with a nice view. And to top it all off- it was in Cambridge where people really embraced the idea of self powered transportation.

So I would demo for people- take really fast runs, gather crowds. Then sit and rest. Eventually skateboarders would wander by and ask about the Turner Boards, and other unusual looking slalom decks- I'd show them how the boards turned and pumped around a bit. Some of the kids would start to ride. And then they would ask me to take a run so I'd try to take a slow run through the cones. They'd start doing it- and were having fun.


Of course someone would show up later and say "Hey John, Why don't you start up on the bridge and take a really fast run for my friend to check out?" So I'd take a fast run....the Newbie would think that they would never be able to get that fast- that it was just freakish fast...and leave because they thought they felt like they looked inept skating along side me in the other lane. With all this effort- over 5 years I got about 15 people to buy decks and about 4 regular slalomers. But hundreds and hundreds of inliners who all started like you guys - slow and together. Their pack grew together as a herd. I let the Inliners run that course now and am no longer "M
ayor of Memorial Drive".

So while having a Rabbit around can be a good thing (lucky) it can be discouraging. Having a slower skaters around can be helpful when getting Newbies into it.

So Karl- you are the kid that the new kids try to beat.....it's almost (ironic) unfortunate that you have gotten fast. But thankfully now there are other kids that you have in your crew for the newer kids to try and beat.


So the very last thing I wanted to do is make you guys so fast that you wouldn't be able to start your own club.

So while there are Rabbits.... there are also crippled Wildebeests that bring up the rear that NO ONE wants to lose to. Having a crippled Wildebeest that regularly brings up the rear of the herd....pass you..Well that motivates the entire herd to go faster.

So from time to time I coach the "Wildebeests" to go faster. BTW I also coach "Randoms" (people that seemingly get fast and come out of nowhere with no prior race experience) to add surprise.

Sometimes - very rarely, the Wildebeest can not be taught (or they never practice enough). You are fortunate- in that you do not fall into this category. This year- you just might be the B-group Wildebeest.

Can you spot a Wildebeest? And think carefully...it sounds better if you break it up into two words.

The best Wildebeest of all time? Too early to tell.

The slalom community is my demented little garden. You never know what I'll plant next.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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Post by Ron Barbagallo » Thu Mar 23, 2006 5:57 pm

Hey John, thanks for being nice to a fat Wildebeast :)
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Post by Karl Floitgraf » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:23 pm

Alright John

I can respect that we were pushed a lot harder to organize and skate harder. Although there are negative effects certain coaching methods, such as if someone asks "How do you stop?" and you just say "jump off" don't be surprised when the nose of your pretty foam core is dinged up. :)

John

The team worked very hard last weekend to collect bottles and cans to get another batch of tshirts. I have one for you if you want it.
Image
It's been 3 years, the kids who picked up cones at the last big Boston Slalom Contest are running this one.

You can pick it up at the Arboretum this weekend if you want. No hard feelings.
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Post by Chris Barrett » Thu Mar 23, 2006 7:41 pm

Karl Floitgraf wrote:Alright John

I can respect that we were pushed a lot harder to organize and skate harder. Although there are negative effects certain coaching methods, such as if someone asks "How do you stop?" and you just say "jump off" don't be surprised when the nose of your pretty foam core is dinged up. :)

John

The team worked very hard last weekend to collect bottles and cans to get another batch of tshirts. I have one for you if you want it.
Image
It's been 3 years, the kids who picked up cones at the last big Boston Slalom Contest are running this one.

You can pick it up at the Arboretum this weekend if you want. No hard feelings.
Nice logo!
Image

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Post by Joe Iacovelli » Thu Mar 23, 2006 8:59 pm

Nice logo

It's obviously my silhouette. You can't mistake my excellent form.

Expect a Cease and Desist from my attorney.

Joe

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Secondary Schools

Post by Paul Pellerin » Thu Mar 23, 2006 9:59 pm

Whew!! Thanks John!!

Actually, I would be willing to throw in a few sets of wheels. Of course the Needham crew would be outfitted with the new ZigZags.

The T-shirt idea is a great idea as well.


Joe - No way that is you on the t-shirt - You are not that slim and the board doesn't appear to have any bite marks.

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Re: Secondary Schools

Post by Miguel Marco » Thu Mar 23, 2006 10:46 pm

Paul Pellerin wrote:Joe - No way that is you on the t-shirt - You are not that slim
Of course not! It's pretty obvious it's me:
Image
:lol: :lol: :lol:

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Post by Karl Floitgraf » Fri Mar 24, 2006 1:24 am

This is obviously Vlad, we kinda stole that design from his old avatar. Props to him. I gotta send him a tshirt.
Last edited by Karl Floitgraf on Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:21 am, edited 1 time in total.
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fooled me

Post by John Gilmour » Fri Mar 24, 2006 4:08 am

I thought it was Bryan- at full reach.

cool shirts.

I'll ask if I can get a few hours off on Saturday.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

John Gilmour
Team Roe Racing
Team Roe Racing
Posts: 1207
Joined: Tue Aug 27, 2002 2:00 am
Location: USA

secondary school update Oct. 2006

Post by John Gilmour » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:35 am

So a lot has gone on in the 3 years that I started this thread.

Here is a list of the current schools that have already participated or have said they will participate this year.

Hotchkiss
Marvelwood (snowboard program)
South Kent
Miss Porters School for Girls
Miss Halls school for Girls
Deerfield
Salisbury
The Gunnery

Here are schools that are considering it.

Choate
Taft
Kent
Canterbury
Trinity Pauling
Gould Academy (ski/snowboard schools)
Avon Old Farms


Here are schools not yet approached

Loomis Chaffe
Phillips Andover
Phillips Exeter
Groton
St. Georges
St. Pauls
Pomfret
Carabassett Valley Academy (ski/snowboard schools)
Stratton mountain school (ski/snowboard schools)
Burke Academy (ski/snowboard schools)
Waterville Academy (ski/snowboard schools)
Holderness (strong ski snowboard program)

Interestingly enough…. Until a few weeks ago, not a single school had said “No” to a skateboard clinic. Then I contacted Westminster and spoke with a Mr. Phillips. As soon as he heard the word “skateboarding” he said “not interested”. So I put Westminster on the back burner and decided I would talk to someone else who would be willing to listen and understand what I was talking about.

A student there- Peter Williams ’07 was really stoked on having us come there and clinic his fellow Westminster students. Westminster has amazing hills- some of which could be used for Coleman slides in the corners. I told Peter that he might have to get together some students to sign up for us to come. I saw the hills there- and knew if you had a bunch of kids without any idea of how to control their speed that some kids would wipe out and get hurt.

Well in the past 2 weeks- that is exactly what happened- a couple of kids went night riding. So I am going to try and pitch the slalom clinic to them again. We will see if they are more sensible this time about teaching skateboarding safety. Currently they have restricted skateboarding on their campus (which legally puts them more at risk and does nothing to teach kids to skate safely off campus.

I couldn’t imagine not having a gymnastic coach come and teach safety and technique if kids were doing gymnastics by themselves on campus.

One reason why skateboarding has had dramatically fewer injuries today is because kids have people to learn from today- as opposed to in the 1970’s when everyone was a learning kid at the same time. Flail and bail was the norm.

---update
spoke to the Asst. Headmaster at Westminster- we discussed the accidents, agreed that properly instruction will help prevent the majority of accidents which are mostly based upon poor judgment. We agreed that there is nothing wrong with pushing ones limits but doing so in small tested increments was superior to “going huge”. So now it would appear that the only “No” is on its way to becoming a “Yes”.
I think it is time we had a skateboard contest involving the kids on their own campus. They can see how pros run--- and run with pros.
One good turn deserves another
john gilmour

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