Red Clay Cup 2005

Chris Barker · Post by **Chris Barker** » Tue Apr 12, 2005 9:46 pm

I predict Pirnack will break those ramps before the day has finished. Screech thinks it's necessary to pop a wheelie on his way out of the gate.

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 12, 2005 7:57 pm

Claude Regnier wrote:Are there going to be decks on those thingy's?

Yes.

Red Clay Cup '04 - Elisa Campbell

Claude Regnier · Post by **Claude Regnier** » Tue Apr 12, 2005 5:01 pm

Hey Rick!

Are there going to be decks on those thingy's?

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 12, 2005 1:11 pm

Michael Dong wrote:Will start ramps be used or will it be push starts? Any chance of getting a pic of the start ramps? If no ramps, how much of a push do we get?

Friday, Giant Slalom - limited push start.....you have to be careful, if you push in too hard you will blow out (1 cone DQ)

Saturday, Slalom - ramp start

2003 Red Clay Cup - Ricky Byrd vs. Josh Byrd

pre-Byrd style ramps of my own design...some people find them a bit sketchy....Mandarino finds them made out of balsa wood

Michael Dong · Post by **Michael Dong** » Tue Apr 12, 2005 8:31 am

Hi 66,

Will start ramps be used or will it be push starts? Any chance of getting a pic of the start ramps? If no ramps, how much of a push do we get?

Psyched for my first Red Clay,

Michael

Tod Oles · Post by **Tod Oles** » Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:01 am

Rob,

I get into Atlanta at 9:54am fri. and have rental car, but I don't leave till monday.
I'll be stag so a ride over is no prob... If the Iacovelli ride falls through....

Joe Iacovelli · Post by **Joe Iacovelli** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 5:02 pm

Rob,

If Lisa and I upgrade our car we can take you inbound on Friday morning.

I'll confirm our time and make sure before we upgrade the car.

Joe

Robert Sydia · Post by **Robert Sydia** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:08 pm

Chris:

Sounds great - just e-mailed Rick - hopefully there is a place to rest my head

Really looking forward to getting together with eveyone - got my first day on cones last night (snow and sh#$t finally off the roads).

All the best,

Rob

Christopher Bara · Post by **Christopher Bara** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:02 pm

Hey Syd....room could be free if you act fast....pony up the entrance fee and there may be some room key's left..

We fly in to Atlanta around 1:30, but we leave around 4:00ish on Sunday...we may have room for you on the way back, depending on how many of us can fit in a car

Robert Sydia · Post by **Robert Sydia** » Fri Apr 08, 2005 4:00 pm

Hey Guys:

First time heading to Georgia and I was wondering if anyone wants to share accomodations and car from airport.

I arrive at Atlanta airport Friday morning @ 9:30 AM, leave Sunday 5:00 PM.

Help a Canadian out finding a way to get to Athens and a place to sleep.

Will accept all invites.

Please e-mail me directly

Thanks

Rob

Kenny Mollica · Post by **Kenny Mollica** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 9:07 pm

Rick-
I am dropping my check in the mail in about 18.065 seconds.

Paul Graf · Post by **Paul Graf** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 7:10 pm

Rick,

Just curious.. the list you just posted doesn't match the list on NCDSA. what up wit dat?

paul

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Thu Apr 07, 2005 5:21 pm

Luna Slalom Jam

Kenny Mollica · Post by **Kenny Mollica** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 5:03 pm

Noah is gnar and will be battling it out for 2nd or 3rd in the GS. The guy has got some talent and the "eye of the Tiger" race day. You cant' train for the eye. He'll pull it out like he always does. Thats what he does.

Having a kid made me faster, and I am sure the same thing happened to Noah. He's no. 2 in my book.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:55 am

Noah's having a race?

I'll be there only if it has extra "gnar".

Troy Smart · Post by **Troy Smart** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 4:07 am

"Troy, it's come a long way from the horse barn in a tropical storm, get ready to step skateboard racing up to the next level. "

Right back at ya.

Hans Koraeus · Post by **Hans Koraeus** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 3:02 am

I see that you are trying to dive into the world ranking rules. So what's next? Rocket sience?

The rules behind the World Ranking are something that have evolved during a long time and it's hard to grasp it all the first time around. It's just too much. You have to kind of take it on bit by bit.

But let's start of with some points that might clear things up.

1.
If you want to use the World Rankings to set up the brackets for Red Clay Cup then it is the current March 31 rankings that you should use. Next calculation is April 30 and that is too late.

2.
Chris is right that some pro racers might suffer in the Pro Men World Ranking. For example if 2005 is your first Pro season. And even a little with only one pro season under your belt. But with the new virtual year point system these problems are actually minimized.

But, we must not forget that using the World Rankings for building up brackets like Rick proposes is not the ideal solution. The ideal solution is of course running normal qualifications. But Ricks idea is good in situations where you want to run a head to head race with a very limited time schedule.

3.

I'd like to be able to click on any number on the rankings site and have it be able to show me how that number is calculated, eliminating the mystery. Originally there was a big chart that showed which points you picked up at which events. That helped.

This will happen. We have not had time to implement this function yet though. But I can do it manually for those who want to know.

4.
The current World Ranking point system is made to produce a certain stability. But big steps can be taken in the ranking by Rookies and for Pros during their first seasons.

5.
Each of the World Rankings point to one of the existing Season or 4-year rankings. This depending on what is the most appropriate for the specific class. For amateur and junior classes where many top racers are likely to move up a class during a 4 year period it makes more sense for the world ranking to use the season rankings. For the other classes where top racers are likely to stay for many years the more long-term 4-Year rankings seems to make more sense.

World rankings
Here are the official World Ranking classes and their under laying ranking in parentheses.
- World ranking, Men Pro (4-Year ranking, Men Pro)
- World ranking, Men Am (Season ranking, Men Am)
- World ranking, Women (4-Year ranking, Women Total)
- World ranking, Boys (Season ranking, Men Juniors -17)
- World ranking, Girls (Season ranking, Women Juniors -17)

6.
My personal thoughts and nothing to do with the World Ranking.
- In the elite class I think only "Pros" should enter. If not enough pros to fill up the 16 places the better racers will jump over the first round. They will probably have enough runs anyway.
- The Open class should have only "no-Pros". If not filling up evenly to 16 or 32 then let the better racers skip the first round as above for the pros. For example if 17 open riders then only 16 and 17 runs first round.

World Ranking Rules
1. For you who want to take the first step:
Short description of the Ranking March 31
Short description of the Ranking Calendar

2. For you who want to know more about the season calculations:
Season rank calculations

3. For you who want to know it all start here.
Complete World Ranking Rules
Start with the introduction and the overview.

Jim Weatherwax · Post by **Jim Weatherwax** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 2:23 am

Chris Barker wrote:Ok, then points from Salem, Luna, Greeley, and next Pumpstation may affect the Red Clay bracketing?

Great...that means more of you who seemed to think Jason only won the Super G at worlds because of the wind, can now come take another lump as he , Barker and Fluitt smoke you on their home hill, and move you further down the Athens bracket...
(Actually, none of these guys have ridden Water Valley since before worlds)

Christopher Bara · Post by **Christopher Bara** » Wed Apr 06, 2005 1:13 am

uhhhhhhhhhh.............well now....THAT clears things up!

hmmmmmmmm

Chris Barker · Post by **Chris Barker** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:10 pm

It says at slalomrankings.com that points are only updated at beginning of the month so points from April races won't be added until May. And they would only be a factor if you used the 2005 Season Rankings which try to update/merge last year's points with this year's points. Even a big change in 2005 points will barely move a 4-yr ranking value.

Maybe I am just confused... Hopefully Hans will chime in...

Here's text from rules section at slalomranking.com

Season rankings (1Y)
A yearly ranking only counting results from one specific season. Season is Jan 1 to Dec 31.

4-year rankings (4Y)
Counting results from the last 4 seasons. The three best seasons are added together with the third best season only counting 50%. The worst season of the four last does not count. Having one year that does not count in the last 4-year period solves the greater part of the problems when getting a season spoiled because of injury or other private matters (studies, work, having a child, health issues a.s.o.).

Season rank calculations:

During different periods during the year the number of best discipline results counted for the current season are different. In the beginning it is lower and then increases until the end of the year when the full 8/6 best results count.

There will be fixed dates during the year when rankings are calculated. This will be done at the end of each month. There are three exceptions: January, February and November.

In the calendar you can see the official dates for all the World Ranking calculations during the season. You can also see how many of the best discipline results for the current season that are counted into the rankings at that time.

For example:
- In the World Ranking, March 31, only the 2 best discipline results for the current season will count in the rankings calculated.
- In the World Ranking, April 30, the 3 best results will count in the pro rankings and the 2 best discipline results in the other rankings.

Noah Heinle · Post by **Noah Heinle** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 10:04 pm

Hey, I'm having a race next weekend. Troy and I are gonna win. I'll post the results for points compilation in a seperate forum.

Bring in on Molleeka.

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 8:11 pm

Chris Barker wrote:Ok, then points from Salem, Luna, Greeley, and next Pumpstation may affect the Red Clay bracketing?

Yes.

Chris Barker · Post by **Chris Barker** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 8:10 pm

Ok, then points from Salem, Luna, Greeley, and next Pumpstation may affect the Red Clay bracketing?

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 7:52 pm

Chris Barker wrote:Why are we qualifying the first big race of 2005 using "points"

because I support the World Rankings (http://www.slalomranking.com)

Wesley Tucker · Post by **Wesley Tucker** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 7:44 pm

Chris Barker wrote:Why are we qualifying the first big race of 2005 using "points" from 2003 and 2004.

The Luna Slalom Jam in Ridgeland (Jackson), Mississippi is two weeks before The Red Clay Cup.

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 7:43 pm

Gary Fluitt wrote:Just curious how your going to use Harms, Goad, Ohm, Smart, Thompson, Plunkett, Byrd, Howard in both divisions. They either fill the bottom of the Elite or the Top of the Open, but how do they do both?

they don't do both

Ohm, Smart and Harms would probably round out the top 16

Goad, Thompson, Byrd, Plunkett, Howard, et al would be the "Open" division, probably with the top seeds getting a bye

I just hadn't spoken with all those people to see which division they chose to race in.

It's not set in stone (yet, will be 10 days before race), but I think it will work.

I'm not racing (Saturday....Friday I'm winning).

Chris Barker · Post by **Chris Barker** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 7:31 pm

Why are we qualifying the first big race of 2005 using "points" from 2003 and 2004. In the 4-year ranking, where do 2005 points come from already? I see points for 2003, 2004, and 2005 at that site. Gilmour has been rehabbing. Noah had to take time off last year so his points sufferred. Anyone that ran open in 2003, but "pro" in 2004 gets their 2003 points discounted since they are not "pro" points.

Until someone shows exactly how these magic numbers are computed, they remain mystery numbers to the rest of us and subject to speculation. I've seen my ranking numbers move all over the board as the site has evolved, especially the 2003 numbers.

I'd like to be able to click on any number on the rankings site and have it be able to show me how that number is calculated, eliminating the mystery. Originally there was a big chart that showed which points you picked up at which events. That helped.

Let's qualify based on real times not magic numbers if possible...

If you gave Mollica/Bomber the 1-2 spots, you would have just as fair an ordering if you drew those names out of a hat for the remaining spots. We showed last year that the A class is very close racing. Anyone can be hot for an individual race.

Gary Fluitt · Post by **Gary Fluitt** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:56 pm

This is what I get from the 4 Year Men USA with the addition of Vlad to the mix, for the Elite Bracket.

1 Kenny Mollica, USA

2 Richy Carrasco, USA

3 Michael Dong, USA

4 Gary Fluitt, USA

5 Keith Hollien, USA

6 Jason Mitchell, USA

7 Chris Barker, USA

8 Vlad

9 Bobby Mandarino, USA

10 Noah Heinle, USA

11 John Gilmour, USA

12 Mark McCree, USA

13 David Pirnack, USA

14 Rick Stanziale, USA

15 Jonathan Harms, USA

16 Jeff Goad, USA

Gary Fluitt · Post by **Gary Fluitt** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 6:30 pm

Just curious how your going to use Harms, Goad, Ohm, Smart, Thompson, Plunkett, Byrd, Howard in both divisions. They either fill the bottom of the Elite or the Top of the Open, but how do they do both?

Christopher Bara · Post by **Christopher Bara** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 3:27 pm

Isnt there a way to get from the Atlanta airport and wrap around the southeast side of atlanta?.......i could have sworn there was another highway.....

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:15 pm

Noah Heinle wrote:bracketed based on ranking? where are these rankings?

THESE ARE NOT THE FINAL BRACKETS, BUT THIS IS THE FORMULA I'M WORKING WITH

4 year rankings - http://www.slalomranking.com

The Elite Class:

1 Mollica
2 Carrasco
3 Dong
4 Fluitt
5 Hollien
6 Mitchell
7 Barker
8 Mandarino
9 Heinle
10 Popov
11 Gilmour
12 McCree
13 Pirnack

Harms, Goad, Ohm, Smart, Thompson, Plunkett, Byrd, Howard, .....will round out Elite bracket of 16

The Open Bracket:

1-5 Harms, Goad, Ohm, Smart, Thompson, Plunkett, Byrd, Howard
6 Wes E
7 Josh Byrd
8 Jadranko
9 Lynn Kramer
10 Eric Moore
11 Tway
12 Ben Chapman
13 Iacovelli
14 Favero
15 Low J
16 Thrasher
etc. etc.

The top Open seeds will most likely receive early round "byes"

Marty Schaub · Post by **Marty Schaub** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:47 pm

Whew....

Trying to get from Atlanta airport to Athens on a Friday afternoon is a major pain. You go through downtown (I85), into one of the busiest counties we have (Gwinnett), onto a two lane highway (Hwy 316) choked with commuters that comes complete with traffic lights.

Check out an Atlanta map and see if you can head out of the airport onto Highway 20 and get to Athens. I am not sure that this is a viable alternative or not. I'll watch the local traffic web-site Friday and post the travel time results. I would look at changing your arrival time, no kidding. One wreck on 85, 316 or 20 and your done.....

Good Luck!

Noah Heinle · Post by **Noah Heinle** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:16 pm

bracketed based on ranking? where are these rankings?

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 12:22 pm

Twilight Criterium http://www.athenstwilight.com

Chris Barker · Post by **Chris Barker** » Tue Apr 05, 2005 3:07 am

Six - What is the latest on qualifying? Those discussions about using World Ranking Points seemed to have disappeared...

Troy Smart · Post by **Troy Smart** » Mon Apr 04, 2005 8:22 pm

Hey Rick,

It's my birthday on May 1.
I know you're busy, but could you arrange for a cake?

Thanks.

Hint: (chocolate with marshmallow frosting)

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:53 pm

Christopher Bara wrote:Hey folks....what's the best way from Atlanta Airport to Trade Street at 2:00 on a Friday afternoon, up I-85 thru the city, or I-285, around the horn and connect to I-85 past the city......?

Yahoo Maps Driving Directions http://maps.yahoo.com/dd

just type in ATL

& Trade Street, Bogart GA

it's only an hour if you drive over 70mph

here is a map for getting around Athens during the weekend - http://www.68mm.com/beatrice/redclaycupmap05.JPG

Ricky Byrd · Post by **Ricky Byrd** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:30 pm

We can do this. We ran 50 racers in 3 hours at LSJ 2004.

Get the city to allow a cousre to be set a few days ahead of race day. Be there staging everything on the side of the road that morning, when your cleared to begin move it all 20 feet over and your racing.

Now for something to really worry about...

Is SPOA lit at night?

Christopher Bara · Post by **Christopher Bara** » Fri Apr 01, 2005 8:27 pm

Hey folks....what's the best way from Atlanta Airport to Trade Street at 2:00 on a Friday afternoon, up I-85 thru the city, or I-285, around the horn and connect to I-85 past the city......?

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 3:22 pm

Wesley Tucker wrote:I don't know exactly how this is going to go off, but I hope no one is expecting a casual day at the races.

Practice begins at noon

Course needs to be cleared no later than 5pm

Wesley Tucker · Post by **Wesley Tucker** » Mon Mar 28, 2005 3:18 pm

OK, not to start any trouble,

I just looked at the Athens Twilight schedule of events. The Red Clay Cup is 1-4 PM. Is that correct? That's THREE HOURS. Is that three hours for everything? Set up, course setting, ramps, and tear down? For some reason I had thought Rick secured the street from 12-5 PM for five hours. Even if there is some major ass busting and both set up and tear down get accomplished in a half hour each, that leaves two hours for racing. I didn't even consider any time for course practice.

Wow.

I hope for 66's sake everyone comes ready to race. I don't think there will be a split second to spare to wait while someone is changing wheels or adjusting a truck. I don't know exactly how this is going to go off, but I hope no one is expecting a casual day at the races.

Tom Thompson · Post by **Tom Thompson** » Sat Mar 26, 2005 11:07 pm

Trade St.....carved and sliced it for a couple of hours this morning....yum yum, mighty tasty! oughta be the main event. wish IT was in downtown Athens....

Troy!

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Fri Mar 25, 2005 1:00 pm

Troy Smart wrote:I'm confused.

Is it up to the racer to decide if he wants to race elite or open or is it already decided?

According to previous posts its up to the racer but according to your last one its based on the slalomskateboarder rankings.

Make up your damn mind.

Bitch.

If you are currently ranked as "Pro" according to World Ranking, you will race "Elite" in Athens.

If you are currently ranked as "Open" according to World Ranking, you have the option (at my discretion) to race "Elite".

All "Open" racers choosing to race as "Elite", must do so prior to arriving at the race venue on Friday afternoon.

All "Elite" racers must solicit schwag to hand out to open racers.
--

Red Clay Update 4/4/2005

I got insurance (I think).

Visited Trade Street (did not skate, had just sessioned 2 hours at SPOA) - it's a different venue in the spring as opposed to the late summer/early fall conditions we saw this past year. Been some construction at both ends, but they've actually helped clean the place up and the road is unchanged (course still marked in red paint if anyone wants to make the trip). The section of Washington Street we plan to race on this year is steeper than last years course, the asphalt still sucks, and the road has an oh so slight lean to it (not nearly as perceptible as the Morro Bay Tight Slalom 2004).

Confirm a Game Day Condo space NOW - 1 key remains, handed out in order of paid (Paypal - paypal at stanziale dot com) - the rest of you will be staying at Team Clay World Headquarters, approximately 1.5 miles from the downtown venue, or on the floors of Game Day. I'm sorry everyone won't get a bed, rooms are tight during Twilight and I never expected so many people to sign up.

Troy, it's come a long way from the horse barn in a tropical storm, get ready to step skateboard racing up to the next level.

Sunday May 1st - Do some real skateboarding with the locals - Skate Park of Athens

And as long as I'm rambling.....there is no better way to get the Athens experience than to crawl the bars - I highly recommend staying on the west side of downtown and visiting Room XIII, 40 Watt, Manhattan Cafe, Caledonia..........the rest is up to you

6

Troy Smart · Post by **Troy Smart** » Thu Mar 24, 2005 8:13 pm

I'm confused.

Is it up to the racer to decide if he wants to race elite or open or is it already decided?

According to previous posts its up to the racer but according to your last one its based on the slalomskateboarder rankings.

Make up your damn mind.

Bitch.

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 11:28 pm

http://athenstwilight.com/schedule.asp

Tom Thompson · Post by **Tom Thompson** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 11:25 pm

Right back at ya Mike. Looking forward to seeing ya'll. BTW, I wasn't trolling you with that "who cares" remark. I like it when everyone is bracketed together. It gives the dark horses a chance to step up. On the other hand, this race is going to have ALOT of spectators. Close racing is exciting to watch. I'm assuming that weighed heavily into Ricks decision to have an elite class. I'm good with it.

Rick Stanziale · Post by **Rick Stanziale** » Sat Mar 19, 2005 1:44 pm

http://athenstwilight.com/schedule.asp

Christopher Bara · Post by **Christopher Bara** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:54 pm

Hey Mike...Rick posted up...somewhere around one of these forums...that you'd have to declare yourself elite (pro) when you sign up...put's you in with the top racers...and the payout is higher.....and as i recall, you'd have to bring something from a sponsor as a prize, but dont quote me on that part

Tom Thompson · Post by **Tom Thompson** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:25 am

i see more than 10....who cares. lets just roll....fast n gnarly, aw yeah.

asking for a super tight tech course on washington st. is probably a waste of time, eh??

Tom Thompson · Post by **Tom Thompson** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:14 am

i see more than 10....who cares. lets just roll....fast n gnarly, aw yeah.

asking for a super tight tech course on washington st. is probably a waste of time, eh??

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Red Clay Cup 2005

Re: Decks

Decks

Re: Start Ramps or Push Start?

Start Ramps or Push Start?

Share Room & Car

Registered Racers?

Atlanta Traffic

Re: This is gonna be a tight race no matter what the cone sp

This is gonna be a tight race no matter what the cone space!

UPDATED 4/4/2005

Re: ga

qualifying

qualifying